Author: jacobvcrites

  • Why Don’t Jehovah’s Witnesses Accept Blood Transfusions?

    What JW.ORG Says

    What JW.ORG says:

    from jw.org
    • Myth: Many Witnesses, including children, die each year as a result of refusing blood transfusions.
    • Fact: This statement is totally unfounded. Surgeons regularly perform such complex procedures as heart operations, orthopedic surgery, and organ transplants without the use of blood transfusions. * Patients, including children, who do not receive transfusions usually fare as well as or better than those who do accept transfusions. * In any case, no one can say for certain that a patient will die because of refusing blood or will live because of accepting it.

    The Truth

    Is it true that “no one can say for certain that a patient will die because of refusing blood or will live because of accepting it”? What about physicians and other medical professionals?

    • NPR: “Over his parents’ objections, 14-year-old Dennis Lindberg refused vital blood transfusions that could have saved him because it was against his faith as a Jehovah’s Witness.” … “So we’ve got a 14-year-old boy who died this week of something that was medically pretty treatable and had a pretty good survivability rate.”
    • CBC: A Quebec coroner has found that the refusal of blood transfusions played a key role in the deaths of two Jehovah’s Witnesses who died of childbirth complications last year.

      Dr. Luc Malouin looked into the deaths of Mirlande Cadet, 46, and Éloïse Dupuis, 26, after they died in separate incidents at hospitals in Montreal and Quebec City… In his report about Dupuis’s case, Malouin pointed out that sometimes, doctors and medical staff find themselves in “untenable” situations. ‘On the one hand, they have taken the oath to protect and save human life and, on the other hand, they have an obligation to respect their patient’s freedom of choice, even if they know that ultimately that choice will kill them when a simple medical treatment could prevent that death.’ 
    • Vice: “ Jay Requarth is a retired cardiothoracic surgeon who worked on a trauma case with a 15-year-old Jehovah’s Witness during his residency. The teen required a lifesaving blood transfusion, which the ER team implemented.

      “When the family arrived,” Requarth says. “They rushed into the trauma bay and ripped down the blood. Obviously, this is a huge issue for the family and the caregivers, but the courts side with the physicians in these cases. In my case, we contacted the hospital’s lawyer who instructed us to proceed. The police were called to remove the family.
    • Washington Post:
      Why doctors let a Jehovah’s Witness and her unborn child dieThe pregnant woman suffered from acute promyelocytic leukemia (APL), a treatable condition: The American Cancer Society says that “more than 90% of patients with APL go into remission with standard induction treatment.” The authors of the letter also note that pregnant women with the cancer have reported an 83 percent remission rate, with a good outlook for their babies when the women are diagnosed in their second or third trimesters.

      In this case, the patient repeatedly declined blood products — including red cell, white cell, platelets or plasma transfusions — while knowing that such a decision could have drastic consequences, including death, the letter says. 

    These are just a few stories that happened to have made national headlines. Despite Watchtower’s unfounded proclamation that “nobody” can say for sure, physicians, coroners and other medical professionals can and have determined that unnecessary deaths do occur because of Jehovah’s Witnesses’ stance on blood transfusions, including children.

    Watchtower also encourages its members to be willing to die rather than accept a blood transfusion:

    • But suppose one’s wife or child were near death. Giving blood, no matter who the loved one might be, would still constitute a violation of God’s law. Just because one is near death, this does not give one liberty to break God’s commands. When one is near death is no time to tamper with or violate the law of God, but a time to draw as near as possible to God by remaining faithful. Everlasting life is the reward for faithfulness. How foolish it would be to gamble away the prospect of life eternal for the very uncertain promise of a cure by blood transfusion!​—Rev. 2:10. w70 4/15 pp. 245-252

    What JW.ORG Says

    “This is a religious issue rather than a medical one. Both the Old and New Testaments clearly command us to abstain from blood. (Genesis 9:4; Leviticus 17:10; Deuteronomy 12:23; Acts 15:28, 29) Also, God views blood as representing life. (Leviticus 17:14) So we avoid taking blood not only in obedience to God but also out of respect for him as the Giver of life.”

    The Truth

    Even if it’s true that “God views blood as representing life,” why would the representation of life be more important to Jehovah than life itself? Would that not be be like a husband who viewed his wedding ring as more important than his marriage?

    In the companion article, “What does the Bible say about blood transfusions?  the following is stated:

    • “History shows that early Christians refused to consume whole blood or even to use it for medical reasons.”

    However, Watchtower does not cite any historical evidence to support the incredible claim that “history shows” early  Christians  refused blood for medical reasons. Bible writers would have had no concept of blood transfusions, which would not be invented for centuries.

    When speaking of the Bible’s mandate to “abstain from blood,” typically Watchtower gives the following defense:

    • “Examine the scriptures carefully and notice that they tell us to ‘keep free from blood’ and to ‘abstain from blood.’ (Acts 15:20, 29) What does this mean? If a doctor were to tell you to abstain from alcohol, would that mean simply that you should not take it through your mouth but that you could transfuse it directly into your veins? Of course not! So, too, ‘abstaining from blood’ means not taking it into our bodies at all.” tr chap. 19 pp. 163-169

    This is a flimsy illustration, seeing as many over-the-counter medications contain alcohol and would not be prohibited for alcoholics, such as anti-diarrheal medicine, laxatives, iron products and anti-emetics.

    The Bible forbids eating blood, which would have been a safeguard for followers of the Mosaic Law as well as early Christians, given that eating blood is incredibly dangerous:

    • “any animal that consumes blood regularly runs a risk of iron overdose…haemochromatosis can cause a wide variety of diseases and problems, including liver damage, buildup of fluid in the lungs, dehydration, low blood pressure, and nervous disorders.” LiveScience.com

    Yes, eating and digesting blood does not cause the blood to enter the bloodstream and can cause significant health problems. This is not the same as a medical professional carefully injecting clean, filtered blood into one’s veins:

    • “Your blood carries oxygen and nutrients to all parts of your body. Blood transfusions replace blood that is lost through surgery or injury or provide it if your body is not making blood properly.” National Heart, Blood and Lung Institute

    Suffice it to say, injecting alcohol into one’s veins or eating blood would only be a detriment to a patient’s health, while blood transfusions are always used to prolong life, even if there are risks involved.

    Jehovah’s Witnesses claim to have an intense respect for human life:

    • Respect for life is a sacred obligation to the Giver of life, Jehovah God. Of him the psalmist said: “With you is the source of life.” (Psalm 36:9) We owe our lives to God, not only because he created man but also because he has allowed mankind to continue until now and has provided the means for sustaining life. (Acts 14:16, 17

    Is sacrificing the life of one’s own child because of imperfect men’s interpretation of scripture showing respect for life?

    For a more in-depth discussion of Jehovah’s Witnesses’ stance on blood transfusions, head over to jwfacts.com

  • Why Have Jehovah’s Witnesses Changed Some of Their Beliefs?

    What JW.ORG says:

    “We have always used the Bible as the sole authority for our beliefs, so we have adjusted our beliefs as our understanding of the Scriptures has been clarified. 

    “Such changes are in harmony with the Bible principle stated at Proverbs 4:​18: “The path of the righteous is like the bright morning light that grows brighter and brighter until full daylight.” Just as the rising sun reveals details of a landscape gradually, God grants an understanding of divine truth progressively, in his due time. (1 Peter 1:​10-​12) As the Bible foretold, he has accelerated this process during “the time of the end.”​—Daniel 12:4.

    These adjustments in our understanding should neither surprise nor disturb us. Ancient worshippers of God also had mistaken ideas and expectations and needed to adjust their viewpoint.

    God later corrected their misunderstandings, and we pray that he will continue doing the same for us.​—James 1:5.”

    The Truth

    Watchtower begins by misapplying Proverbs 4:18, which they present as a prophecy about changes in Bible understanding. Examining the context shows that Proverbs 4 is not a prophecy, but a series of pieces of practical wisdom being passed on from a father to his sons:

    • Listen, my sons, to the discipline of a father;Pay attention in order to gain understanding,  For I will give you good instruction; Do not forsake my teaching.” Proverbs 4:1,2

    Leading up to verse 18, the “father” begins to contrast the path of a wicked man with the path of a righteous man:

    • 13  Hold on to discipline; do not let it go.Safeguard it, for it means your life.14  Do not enter the path of the wicked, And do not walk in the way of evil men.15  Shun it, do not take it;Turn away from it, and pass it by.16  For they cannot sleep unless they do what is bad. They are robbed of sleep unless they cause someone’s downfall.17  They feed themselves with the bread of wickedness, And they drink the wine of violence.18  But the path of the righteous is like the bright morning light That grows brighter and brighter until full daylight.

    Nowhere in these verses is the slightest hint as to the understanding of bible prophecies growing “brighter.

    Really, Watchtower has changed many of their beliefs not because of God “correcting their understandings,” but because they have made predictions that the passing of time has proven false.

    As just one example, let’s look at Watchtower’s former belief that Armageddon would come in 1925. In 1918, Watchtower proclaimed the following:

    • “Therefore we may confidently expect that 1925 will mark the return of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and the faithful prophets of old, particularly those named by the Apostle in Hebrews 11, to the condition of human perfection,” (Millions Now Living Will Never Die, p. 89).

    In 1922 they doubled down on this:

    1923:

    •  “Our thought is that 1925 is definitely settled by the Scriptures. As to Noah, the Christian now has much more upon which to base his faith than Noah had upon which to base his faith in a coming deluge,” (Watchtower, Apr. 1, 1923, p. 106).

    1925 came and went. None of these things came to pass, despite Watchtower being “confident,” despite the prediction supposedly being “distinctly indicated” and “definitely settled by the scriptures.” Was there an apology? An admission of error? A display of humility?

    Here’s what was said in 1926:

    •  “Some anticipated that the work would end in 1925, but the Lord did not state so. The difficulty was that the friends inflated their imaginations beyond reason; and that when their imaginations burst asunder, they were inclined to throw away everything,” (Watchtower 1926, p. 232).

    The date having come and gone, Watchtower now said some anticipated that the end would come in 1925. The obvious truth is that all Jehovah’s Witnesses anticipated the end would come in 1925, because that was the official Watchtower teaching. But all the blame was placed on faithful members of the congregation for “inflating their imaginations beyond reason,” when all they really did was believe the publications they were told they must trust in order to gain salvation.

    Why did Watchtower change their beliefs? Was it “light getting brighter”? Was it direction from God? Or was it because Watchtower asserted that something would definitely happen, and then it definitely didn’t happen?

    For a deeper dive into changed Watchtower beliefs, check out the wonderful resources at jwfacts.com

    For a detailed timeline of failed endtime predictions, head over to readjw.info

  • Are Jehovah’s Witnesses a Cult? (Part 1)

    What JW.ORG Says

    “No, Jehovah’s Witnesses are not a cult. Rather, we are Christians who do our best to follow the example set by Jesus Christ and to live by his teachings.”

    The Truth

    Yes. Despite being a Bible-based, Christian religion, Jehovah’s Witnesses nonetheless fit the criteria for what constitutes a cult. Jehovah’s Witnesses even meet their own definition of a cult.

    What is a cult?

    “A cult is a group or movement exhibiting excessive devotion to a person or idea and employing unethically manipulative techniques of persuasion and control to advance the goals of its leaders.” W94 2/15 pp. 3-4 (referencing a joint resolution of the 100th congress of the State of Maryland)

    When sociologists, psychologists or other experts seek to determine whether a group is a cult, they must consider a wide variety of factors. They cannot simply rely on a dictionary definition. Cults are complex, and vary in their belief systems, goals, and techniques to recruit and maintain control over their members.

    The model most accepted by experts is the BITE model. (Behavioral Control, Information Control, Thought Control and Emotion Control).

    Here we will examine how Watchtower employs each part of the BITE model to exercise control over its  members:

    Behavioral Control

    • Promote dependence and obedience
      • “So whether you are an adult or a child, learn obedience by accepting discipline so that “it may go well with you” and that “you may endure a long time on the earth.” (Ephesians 6:1-3) Who wants to jeopardize his prospect of living forever by failing to learn obedience by not accepting discipline?”​—John 11:26.” w92 10/1 pp. 26-29

    • Modify behavior with rewards and punishments
      • “Have you ever doubted whether you will enter the new world? It is certainly good not to be overconfident, since our receiving the prize of life is dependent on our remaining faithful to the end.” Watchtower, April 1st 2004
        • Reward: Everlasting life on a paradise earth.
        • Punishment: Destruction at Armageddon if you are not “faithful to the end.”

    • Restrict or control sexuality
      • “You may have to be strict with yourself when improper thoughts about the opposite sex seem to invade your mind. If the thoughts persist, try some physical exercise. The Bible says: ‘Bodily training is beneficial for a little.’ (1 Timothy 4:8) A brisk walk or a few minutes of physical exercise may be all that you need to help you fight off the distracting thoughts.

        “Above all, don’t overlook the help that is available from your heavenly Father. ‘When I feel sexual urges coming on,’ says one Christian, ‘I really make myself pray.’ No, God won’t take away your interest in the opposite sex. But with his help, you can discover that there are many other things to think about.” yp2 chap. 29 pp. 237-242
    From the JW.ORG article “I’m Attracted To the Same Sex–Does That Mean I’m Gay?”
    • Control clothing and hairstyle
      • “The Bible makes it clear that Jehovah, the Sovereign of the universe, has standards for the way he wants his servants to dress. So, what we choose to wear should please not only us but, more important, our Sovereign Lord, Jehovah.” ws16 September pp. 14-19
      • “What message is conveyed by a Christian woman’s hairstyle and hair color (if dyed) or her use of jewelry and cosmetics? Is it: This is a clean, modest, and balanced servant of God?” w91 6/1 pp. 30-31
      • “We also show that we are no part of the world by our dress and grooming. Many people in the world dress to get attention, to stir up immoral thoughts in others, to show rebellion against society, or to show off how much money they have. Other people don’t care what they look like. They may choose to be messy or dirty. We cannot allow any of these attitudes to influence our choice of dress and grooming.” Keep Yourself in God’s Love, Chapter 5

    • Exploit you financially
      • “Jehovah’s Witnesses consider it a privilege to use their money and other resources to advance the preaching work.” od chap. 12 pp. 123-129

      • “Our brothers, even those who are in poor economic situations, are like the Macedonians who were in “deep poverty” and yet begged for the privilege to give and did so generously.​—2 Cor. 8:1-4.” w18 January pp. 17-21


    • Restrict leisure time and activities
      • “Too much time spent on leisure, entertainment, and socializing can lull a person into spending less and less time in spiritual pursuits. We must keep leisure in its proper place.” km 8/01 p. 8

      • “For recreation to benefit us and be pleasing in Jehovah’s eyes, it needs to meet specific standards set out in God’s Word.” w11 10/15 pp. 8-12


    • Require you to seek permission for major decisions
      •  “What will help us to make wise decisions that will contribute to our stability as God’s servants? One longtime Christian said: “I ask for Jehovah’s help when making decisions. I believe it is important to accept and apply counsel given in the Bible, at Christian meetings, by the elders, and in Bible-based publications.” w03 5/15 pp. 21-24

    Information Control

    From the May 2015 Study Edition of the Watchtower. The caption reads: “Satan rejoices when one of Jehovah’s servants commits a sin
    • Deliberately withhold and distort information.
    • Forbid you from speaking with ex-members and critics
      • “Like a kidnapper who carries an unsuspecting victim away from his family, apostates prey upon trusting members of the congregation, seeking to carry them away from the flock… We “avoid them” by steering clear of their reasonings​—whether in person, in printed form, or on the Internet. Why do we take such a stand? First, because God’s Word directs us to do so, and we trust that Jehovah always has our best interests at heart.” w04 2/15 pp. 15-20
      • “Food on the table of demons is poisonous. Consider, for example, the food dispensed by the evil slave class and the apostates. It does not nourish or build up; it is not wholesome. It cannot be, for the apostates have stopped feeding at Jehovah’s table. As a result, whatever they had developed of the new personality is gone. What motivates them is, not holy spirit, but vitriolic bitterness. They are obsessed with only one aim​—beating their former fellow slaves, as Jesus foretold.” w94 7/1 pp. 8-13

    From the April 1st 1983 Watchtower, page 20-25
    • Discourage access to non-cult sources of information
      • “Satan tries to influence the way people think by using false information and propaganda. (Read 1 John 5:19.) Newspapers, books, magazines, radio, TV, and the Internet spread information over the whole earth. These sources offer some useful information, but they often promote conduct that goes against Jehovah’s standards. (Jeremiah 2:13) For example, they may say that there is nothing wrong with same-sex marriage.” Watchtower August 2014 Study Edition

      • Our Bible students also need to learn how to study. When they are new, we are happy to see them simply underline the answers in preparation for their Bible study or for congregation meetings. But we do need to teach our Bible students how to do research and how to do meaningful study on their own. In that way, when problems arise, instead of immediately turning to others in the congregation for help, they will know how to get practical advice for themselves by doing research in our publications.”  w19 May pp. 26-31
      • The most thorough article published by the Witnesses on “How to Do Research” mentions only to use Watchtower-published resources, with one stray mention on using a public library “if necessary.”  be p. 33-p. 38 par. 4


    • Divide information into Insider vs. Outsider doctrine
      • “…no one can really be happy unless he is a friend of Jehovah, ‘the happy God…’ Worldly thinking is based on human ideas and values rather than on Jehovah’s thinking. It can make us stop trusting in Jehovah, so we need to reject it. We must learn to view matters as Jehovah does.” Watchtower–Simplified Study Edition, November 15th 2017
        • Insiders: Jehovah’s Witnesses
        • Outsiders: “Worldly People”
    From the August 2014 Study Edition of the Watchtower. The caption reads: “How can regular worship protect you from being tricked by Satan?
    • Generate and use propaganda extensively
    • Require you to report thoughts, feelings, & activities to superiors
      • “If we are struggling with wrong sexual desires…Christian elders are especially qualified to help us.” …“Seeking assistance [from the elders] is essential if the source of any immoral desires is the unclean habit of viewing pornography. The longer the delay in seeking help, the greater the risk that unclean desires will ‘become fertile and give birth to sin’ that will hurt others and bring reproach on Jehovah’s name” w15 6/15 pp. 13-17
      • “Today, to regain a good relationship with Jehovah, a Christian who has committed a serious sin needs to go to the elders so that they can help him. Why is this so important? First, it is Jehovah who arranged for the elders to judge cases of serious sin.” (James 5:14-16) ws17 November pp. 9-14
      • “If we let selfish, unclean thoughts and feelings take over, we are in danger of being ensnared by the Devil for the doing of his will. (2 Timothy 2:26) To stand firm against him, we must exercise firm control of our thoughts and emotions as well as of our words and actions. We must discipline our minds to think on things virtuous, righteous, chaste and lovable” w84 10/15 pp. 15-20
      • To be considered an active Jehovah’s Witness, members need to fill out monthly field service reports, documenting their hours and number of placements of Watchtower publications.
    • Encourage you to spy and report on others’ “misconduct”
      • “What if we become aware that someone is involved in a secret sin, perhaps abusing alcohol, viewing pornography, or living an immoral life? (Eph. 5:11, 12) Our turning a blind eye to gross wrongdoing can hinder the free flow of Jehovah’s holy spirit and threaten the peace of the entire congregation. (Gal. 5:19-23) Just as the early Christians in Corinth had to clear out badness, so today any corrupting influence must be kept out of the congregation in order to preserve its healthy, positive spirit. …those Scripturally obligated to handle the matter​—the elders in the congregation—​should be informed” w12 2/15 pp. 18-22

    Thought Control

    • Instill Black vs. White, Us vs. Them, & Good vs. Evil thinking
      • “Like the air we breathe, the spirit of the world is all around us. If we do not work hard to resist that spirit, it will affect us. (Read Proverbs 4:23.) This can begin in ways that seem innocent, such as allowing ourselves to be influenced by the thinking and attitudes of people who do not worship Jehovah. (Proverbs 13:20; 1 Corinthians 15:33) Or we could be affected by such things as pornography, apostasy, or highly competitive sports.​—See Endnote 18.” lvs chap. 5 pp. 60-74
      • “What about you? Do you want to be part of Satan’s world? Or are you for God’s new system? If you are for God’s new system, you will be separate from the world…” pe chap. 25 pp. 208-216
    • Change your identity, possibly even your name
      • Although Watchtower does not ask their members to literally change their name, there is a constant emphasis on adopting “The New Personality” of their religion.
        • “Each of us should ask himself, ‘What more can I do to strip off and keep off the old personality?’ We need to pray fervently for God’s help and work hard to overcome any attitude or practice that will prevent us from inheriting God’s Kingdom. (Gal. 5:19-21)” w17 August pp. 22-26
    • Use loaded language and cliches to stop complex thought
      • “There are just two sides: God’s and the Devil’s” –Awake 1970, August 22 p. 5
      • “Wait on Jehovah”
      • “Where else would you go?”
      • “No other organization ___”
      • “That’s worldly thinking.”
    • Teach thought-stopping techniques to prevent critical thoughts
      • “Doubt can be a powerful, destructive force. If we yield to it, it can eat away at our faith and cause us to sink spiritually. We need to fight back vigorously! How? By keeping the right focus. If we dwell on what scares us, what discourages us, what distracts us from Jehovah and his Son, we will find our doubts growing. If we focus on Jehovah and his Son, on what they have done, are doing, and will do for those who love them, we will keep corrosive doubts at bay.” ia chap. 21 pp. 180-187
    • Allow only positive thoughts
      • “We need to learn to control our thinking and feelings and imitate the way Jehovah thinks, feels, and acts.” ws13 9/15 pp. 21-26
      • “Isn’t it logical that Jehovah expects us to be happy in his service?…Jehovah took such good care of the Israelites, and yet they were not happy. This is something that Jehovah did not like at all. So we can see that serving Jehovah joyfully is very important… Our thoughts are critical and have a bearing on our whole being…we control what we think. We avoid occupying our mind with thoughts that weaken our faith, or thoughts that undermine our determination to serve Jehovah. Happiness does not depend on our circumstances. Happiness depends on doing things Jehovah’s way.” Gajus Glockentin, February 2020 JW Broadcast
    From the No. 3 2019 Awake: Can the Bible Improve Your Life?
    • Use excessive meditation, singing, prayer, & chanting to block thoughts
      • “Young Malika says: “I’ve learned to pray, pray, and pray. Knowing Jehovah cares helps me to feel calm and more in control of my emotions.” With God’s help, you too can learn to control your emotions. Awake! February 22, 2005
    • Reject rational analysis, critical thinking, & doubt
      •  “Fight doubts vigorously. To ignore what appears to be a trivial infection, to do nothing about nagging doubts, may have disastrous consequences. (2 Corinthians 11:3) ‘Are we really living in the last days? Can you believe everything the Bible says? Is this truly Jehovah’s organization?’ Satan would love to plant doubts like these in your mind. Do not let a negligent attitude toward spiritual feeding leave you easy prey to his deceptive teachings. (Colossians 2:4-7)” Watchtower, July 1st 2001
      • “Satan continues to ask the same question he asked Eve in the garden of Eden: ‘Did God really say that . . . ?’ (Gen. 3:1) In the world under Satan’s control, we often hear challenging questions, such as these: ‘Does God really not approve of same-sex marriage? Does God really not want you to celebrate Christmas and birthdays? Does your God really expect you to refuse a blood transfusion? Does a loving God really expect you to avoid association with disfellowshipped loved ones?’ w19 June pp. 8-13

    Emotional Control

    • Instill irrational fears (phobias) of questioning or leaving the group
      • “Any weakening of the truth faith by deliberately compromising with error or by carrying on practices out of line with the high standards of Christian conduct would please the Devil. Such a course would put one on the Devil’s side.” –Awake 1970, August 22nd, p. 5
      • “Satan has the same goal—to worry us, to weaken our zeal, and to cause us to quit. Make no mistake, God’s people are involved in spiritual warfare!” Watchtower September 2014 Study Edition
    • Promote feelings of guilt, shame, & unworthiness
      • “One purpose of marking is to move a disorderly Christian to feel ashamed and stop his unscriptural course” w85 4/15 pp. 30-31
      • “Feeling guilty, then, can be good, even necessary…A guilty conscience can and should move us to confession and other positive action.” g02 3/8 pp. 26-27
      • “Many have a conscience that is, in effect, dead​—so scarred and insensitive that it no longer sends out warnings, protests, or pangs of shame or guilt over wrongdoing. ‘Good riddance,’ many today seem to say to such feelings as guilt.” lv chap. 2 pp. 14-24
    • Shower you with praise and attention (“love bombing”)
      • “As soon as possible, invite fellow members of the congregation to accompany you to the study so that the student starts to make new friends as quickly as possible. It is important that he realizes soon that whatever he loses in the way of friendship in the old system of things will be more than made up for in new acquaintances in ‘the entire association of brothers in the world” w84 11/1 pp. 14-18
      • “All can take the initiative to greet these persons when they come to the Kingdom Hall and engage in upbuilding conversation with them. Show that we are happy to have them with us and that we hope they will continue progressing. This loving interest should continue to be shown as they make spiritual progress. Positive results have been obtained by such united efforts.”
        “…help the inactive ones to see that because of their lack of association with the congregation, their spirituality and happiness have diminished. (Matt. 5:3; Heb. 10:24, 25)” w08 11/15 pp. 12-16
    From the brochure “Return to Jehovah”
    • Threaten your friends and family
      • “Despite our pain of heart, we must avoid normal contact with a disfellowshipped family member by telephone, text messages, letters, e-mails, or social media.” w17 October pp. 12-16
      • Should a Witness not shun their family member—even if it is their child or parent—they are to be disciplined.
        • “Unnecessary Association With Disfellowshipped or Disassociated Individuals: Willful, continued, unnecessary association with disfellowshipped or disassociated nonrelatives despite repeated counsel would warrant judicial action” Shepherd the Flock of God (Elder’s Handbook) Chapter 12, Paragraph 17.
    • Shun you if you disobey or disbelieve
      • Those who are not deemed sufficiently “repentant” for what Watchtower considers a sin will be mandatorily shunned, even by family and friends:  
        • “The Watchtower of September 15, 1981, page 25, stated: “A simple ‘Hello’ to someone can be the first step that develops into a conversation and maybe even a friendship. Would we want to take that first step with a disfellowshiped person?” Is strict avoidance really necessary? Yes…Losing precious fellowship with loved ones may help him to come “to his senses,” see the seriousness of his wrong, and take steps to return to Jehovah.””  –Keep Yourself in God’s Love, Appendix
      • Earnestly questioning the direction of the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses will get the member labeled as an apostate:
        • “Apostates may claim to worship Jehovah and to believe the Bible, but they reject the visible part of his organization [Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses]. …We “avoid them” by steering clear of their reasonings​—whether in person, in printed form, or on the Internet.” Watchtower February 15th, 2004
    • Teach that there is no happiness or peace outside the group
      • “Satan’s world has made humans suffer for some 6,000 years. Now, in the last days of this system, the earth is full of people who focus on themselves, money, and pleasures. They think of what they can get and make their own desires the main thing in life. But people like that cannot be truly happy!” Watchtower January 2018–Simplified Edition
      • “To be separate from Satan’s world means that we do not let “the spirit of the world” control us. That spirit is the way of thinking and behaving that comes from Satan, and it controls those who do not serve Jehovah…The spirit of the world makes people selfish, proud, and rebellious. It makes them think that they do not have to obey God. Satan wants people to do whatever they want without thinking of the consequences. He would like people to believe that “the desire of the flesh and the desire of the eyes”  are the most important things in life. (1 John 2:16; 1 Timothy 6:9, 10) The Devil is trying especially hard to mislead Jehovah’s servants and to trick us into thinking the way he does.​” https://www.jw.org/en/library/books/in-gods-love/keep-separate-from-the-world/
    A typical Watchtower portrayal of a “worldly person,” from the No.2 Awake! 2020
  • Do Jehovah’s Witnesses Believe in Creationism?

    What JW.ORG says

    No. Jehovah’s Witnesses do believe that God created everything. But we do not agree with creationism. Why not? Because a number of creationist ideas actually conflict with the Bible. Consider the following two examples:

    1. Length of the six days of creation. Some creationists assert that the six days of creation were literal 24-hour days. But the word “day” in the Bible can refer to a considerable length of time.​—Genesis 2:4; Psalm 90:4.
    2. Age of the earth. Some creationists teach that the earth is just a few thousand years old. However, according to the Bible, the earth and the universe existed before the six days of creation. (Genesis 1:1) For that reason, Jehovah’s Witnesses have no objection to credible scientific research that indicates the earth may be billions of years old.

    Although Jehovah’s Witnesses believe in creation, we are not antiscience. We believe that true science and the Bible are compatible.”

    The Truth

    What Watchtower describes above is known as “young earth” creationism, which they imply is the only form of creationism. This is untrue. In reality, Jehovah’s Witnesses do believe in creationism: “old earth” creationism.

    • “Old Earth Creationism (OEC), is a variety of creationism which has existed for hundreds of years; it encompasses a wide range of beliefs. Like Young Earth Creationists, Old Earth Creationists hold that various aspects of living things were created by special supernatural intervention. Unlike Young Earth Creationists, however, Old Earth Creationists accept the scientific evidence for the age of the earth and the universe.” National Center for Science Education
    • “Some [creationists], known as “young Earth” creationists, believe the biblical account that the universe and the Earth were created just a few thousand years ago. Proponents of this form of creationism also believe that all living things, including humans, were created in a very short period of time in essentially the forms in which they exist today. Other creationists, known as “old Earth” creationists, accept that the Earth may be very old but reject other scientific findings regarding the evolution of living things.” The National Academies of Sciences, Engineering and Medicine.
  • Do Jehovah’s Witnesses Allow Members to Change Religions?

    Note: In this article we will focus on the section “Does a Person Have a Right to Change Religions?” in the JW.ORG FAQ article, Do Jehovah’s Witnesses Force People to Change Religions?

    What JW.ORG says

    Does a Person Have a Right to Change Religions?

    “Yes, the Bible shows that people have the right to change their religion. It records many who chose not to follow the form of religion practiced by their relatives and who, of their own free will, decided to worship the true God. AbrahamRuth, some of the people of Athens, and the apostle Paul are just a few examples. (Joshua 24:2; Ruth 1:​14-​16; Acts 17:22, 30-​34; Galatians 1:​14, 23) In addition, the Bible even acknowledges a person’s right to make the unwise decision to abandon the worship approved by God.​—1 John 2:​19.

    Image from jw.org

    “The right to change religions is supported by the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, which the United Nations has called “the foundation of international human rights law.” That document states that everyone has the “freedom to change his religion or belief” and “to seek, receive and impart information and ideas,” including religious ideas. * Of course, these rights carry with them the obligation to respect the rights of others both to maintain their beliefs and to reject ideas that they disagree with.

    The Truth

    Note the loaded language in the above statements:

    It records many who chose not to follow the form of religion practiced by their relatives and who, of their own free will, decided to worship the true God.”

    In addition, the Bible even acknowledges a person’s right to make the unwise decision to abandon the worship approved by God”

    According to Watchtower it is perfectly acceptable to convert to become a Jehovah’s Witness, but for a Witness to change to different religion would be an “unwise decision to abandon the worship approved by God.”

    In reality, Jehovah’s Witnesses are not able to leave the religion without being completely shunned by their family and friends:

    • One who has been a true Christian might renounce the way of the truth, stating that he no longer considers himself to be one of Jehovah’s Witnesses or wants to be known as one. When this rare event occurs, the person is renouncing his standing as a Christian, deliberately disassociating himself from the congregation. The apostle John wrote: “They went out from us, but they were not of our sort; for if they had been of our sort, they would have remained with us.”​—1 John 2:19.

      “Or, a person might renounce his place in the Christian congregation by his actions, such as by becoming part of an organization whose objective is contrary to the Bible, and, hence, is under judgment by Jehovah God. (Compare Revelation 19:17-21; Isaiah 2:4.) So if one who was a Christian chose to join those who are disapproved of God, it would be fitting for the congregation to acknowledge by a brief announcement that he had disassociated himself and is no longer one of Jehovah’s Witnesses.

      “Persons who make themselves “not of our sort” by deliberately rejecting the faith and beliefs of Jehovah’s Witnesses should appropriately be viewed and treated as are those who have been disfellowshiped for wrongdoing.” w81 9/15 pp. 20-26

    While their official website states that everyone has a right to change religions, Watchtower insists that anyone who “rejects the faith and beliefs of Jehovah’s Witnesses” should be excommunicated/disfellowshipped. How are “disfellowshipped” people to be viewed and treated by Jehovah’s Witnesses?

    • A simple “Hello” to someone can be the first step that develops into a conversation and maybe even a friendship. Would we want to take that first step with a disfellowshiped person? w81 9/15 pp. 20-26

    This shunning is even to be carried out by close family members and friends:

    • “[Disfellowshipping] may be difficult because of emotions and family ties, such as grandparents’ love for their grandchildren. Yet, this is a test of loyalty to God…Anyone who is feeling the sadness and pain that the disfellowshipped relative has thus caused may find comfort and be encouraged by the example set by some of Korah’s relatives” w88 4/15 pp. 26-31

    Not only would the person leaving the Witnesses for another religion be shunned, they would be given the most severe label that the church assigns: Apostate.

    • “Apostasy: Apostasy is a standing away from true worship, a falling away, defection, rebellion, abandonment. It includes the following:
      • (1) Celebrating False Religious Holidays: (Ex. 32:4-6; Jer. 7:16-19) Not all holidays directly involve false religion and require judicial action.
      • (2) Participation in Interfaith Activities: (2 Cor. 6:14, 15, 17, 18) Apostate acts include bowing before altars and images and sharing in false religious songs and prayers.-Rev. 18:2, 4.
      • (3) Deliberately Spreading Teachings Contrary to Bible Truth: (2 John 7, 9, 10; /vs p. 245; it-1 pp. 126-127) Any with sincere doubts regarding the Bible truth taught by Jehovah’s Witnesses should be helped. Loving assistance should be provided. (2 Tim. 2:16-19, 23-26; Jude 22, 23) If one obstinately is speaking about or deliberately spreading false teachings, this may be or may lead to apostasy. If there is no response after a first and a second admonition, a judicial committee should be formed. Shepherd the Flock of God (Elder’s Manual) Chapter 12, Pg. 92

    Because Watchtower asserts that it is the only organization that promotes “true worship,” anything else is deemed false. The loaded language in the elder’s handbook cited above illustrates this perfectly: If a Witness conscientiously disagrees with Watchtower’s interpretation of scripture and does not keep this to herself, this is spun as “spreading teachings contrary to Bible Truth.

    Apostasy itself is described by Watchtower as a “standing away from true worship,” meaning “any form of worship other than the one approved of by Watchtower.”

    What if an active Jehovah’s Witness does not want to convert to another religion, but simply wishes to resign from the church?

    • “…if a person who is a Christian chooses to disassociate himself, a brief announcement is made to inform the congregation, stating: “[Name of person] is no longer one of Jehovah’s Witnesses.” Such a person is treated in the same way as a disfellowshipped person.” od chap. 14 pp. 141-156

    Therefore, contrary to what is stated on JW.ORG, the reality is that a Witness cannot convert to another religion without losing their entire social network, being shunned by their family, and labeled an “apostate.”

  • Do Jehovah’s Witnesses Break Up Families or Build Them Up?

    What JW.ORG says

    Jehovah’s Witnesses are sometimes accused of breaking up families. But do the Witnesses actually cause discord?

    As Jehovah’s Witnesses, we work to build up families, both our own and those of our neighbors. We respect God as the Creator of the family arrangement. (Genesis 2:​21-​24; Ephesians 3:​14, 15) In the Bible, he teaches principles that have helped people around the world to have marriages that are strong and happy.

    The Truth

    In the cited JW.ORG article Watchtower admits that it has received accusations of breaking up families, but fails to address any of the reasons why these accusations exist in the first place.

    It is telling that the words “disfellowshipping” or “shunning” do not appear in the entire article, which are practices enforced by Watchtower that by definition break families apart. If a Witness commits what Watchtower considers to be a sin and is not sufficiently repentant in the eyes of the congregation elders, that person is expelled from the congregation and is to be shunned completely by church members:

    •  “A simple ‘Hello’ to someone can be the first step that develops into a conversation and maybe even a friendship. Would we want to take that first step with a disfellowshiped person?”   The Watchtower of September 15, 1981, page 25

    This injunction extends to family members. While acknowledging that a marriage-mate converting to the Jehovah’s Witness religion may be a cause for marital strain, the JW.ORG FAQ says nothing about what happens when a family member ceases to believe in the religion.

    • “What if we have a relative or a close friend who is disfellowshipped? Now our loyalty is on the line, not to that person, but to God. Jehovah is watching us to see whether we will abide by his command not to have contact with anyone who is disfellowshipped.​—Read 1 Corinthians 5:11-13.

      Consider just one example of the good that can come when a family loyally upholds Jehovah’s decree not to associate with disfellowshipped relatives. A young man had been disfellowshipped for over ten years, during which time his father, mother, and four brothers “quit mixing in company” with him. At times, he tried to involve himself in their activities, but to their credit, each member of the family was steadfast in not having any contact with him. After he was reinstated, he said that he always missed the association with his family, especially at night when he was alone. But, he admitted, had the family associated with him even a little, that small dose would have satisfied him. However, because he did not receive even the slightest communication from any of his family, the burning desire to be with them became one motivating factor in his restoring his relationship with Jehovah. Think of that if you are ever tempted to violate God’s command not to associate with your disfellowshipped relatives.w12 4/15 pp. 8-12

    Witnesses are taught to ignore their emotions and family ties, viewing the unnatural shunning of a family member as a test of loyalty to God.

    •  “[Disfellowshipping] may be difficult because of emotions and family ties, such as grandparents’ love for their grandchildren. Yet, this is a test of loyalty to God…Anyone who is feeling the sadness and pain that the disfellowshipped relative has thus caused may find comfort and be encouraged by the example set by some of Korah’s relatives” w88 4/15 pp. 26-31

    Although “limited contact” in emergency situations is allowed, Witnesses are expected to have as little association with their disfellowshipped relatives as humanly possible.

    •  It might be possible to have almost no contact at all with the relative. Even if there were some family matters requiring contact, this certainly would be kept to a minimum,” in harmony with the divine injunction to “quit mixing in company with anyone” who is guilty of sinning unrepentantly. (1 Cor. 5:11) km 8/02 pp. 3-4

    Jehovah’s Witnesses are told that questioning this doctrine is a sign of spiritual weakness:

    • If we do not follow what the Bible says about bad associations, disfellowshipping, or entertainment, our heart can become hard. What should you do if this starts happening to you? You urgently need to examine your faith! The Bible says: “Keep testing whether you are in the faith; keep proving what you yourselves are.” (2 Corinthians 13:5) Be honest with yourself, and regularly use God’s Word to correct your thinking.” ws16 June pp. 9-14

    A Jehovah’s Witness can even be disfellowshipped for speaking to a disfellowshipped person:

    • “Unnecessary Association With Disfellowshipped or Disassociated Individuals: Willful, continued, unnecessary association with disfellowshipped or disassociated nonrelatives despite repeated counsel would warrant judicial action” Shepherd the Flock of God (Elder’s Handbook) Chapter 12, Paragraph 17.
  • Who Was the Founder of Jehovah’s Witnesses?

    What JW.ORG says:

    “Ready why Charles Taze Russel was not the founder of a new religion”

    “The modern-day organization of Jehovah’s Witnesses began at the end of the 19th century. At that time, a small group of Bible students who lived near Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, in the United States, began a systematic analysis of the Bible. They compared the doctrines taught by the churches with what the Bible really teaches. They began publishing what they learned in books, newspapers, and the journal that is now called The Watchtower—Announcing Jehovah’s Kingdom.

    “Among that group of sincere Bible students was a man named Charles Taze Russell. While Russell took the lead in the Bible education work at that time and was the first editor of The Watchtower, he was not the founder of a new religion. The goal of Russell and the other Bible Students, as the group was then known, was to promote the teachings of Jesus Christ and to follow the practices of the first-century Christian congregation. Since Jesus is the Founder of Christianity, we view him as the founder of our organization.—Colossians 1:18-20.

    The Truth

    As is stated above, Jehovah’s Witnesses believe that theirs is not a new religion, but rather the natural extension of first century Christianity, and in fact the fulfillment of Bible prophecy. Their brochure “Who Are Doing Jehovah’s Will Today?” asserts that through the Bible Students (early Jehovah’s Witnesses) “Bible truth was rediscovered.”

    • The Bible foretold that after the death of Christ, false teachers would arise among the early Christians and corrupt Bible truth. (Acts 20:29, 30) In time, that is exactly what happened. They mixed Jesus’ teachings with pagan religious ideas, and a counterfeit form of Christianity developed…The time came for Jehovah to reveal the truth. He foretold that during ‘the time of the end, the true knowledge would become abundant.’ (Daniel 12:4) In 1870 a small group of truth-seekers recognized that many church doctrines were not Scriptural. Therefore, they began searching for an understanding of the Bible’s original teachings, and Jehovah blessed them with spiritual insight.

    Both the cited FAQ article as well as the Jehovah’s Will brochure downplay Charles Taze Russel’s involvement, the latter publication excluding him completely. It mentions only “sincere Bible students,” and “a small group of truth-seekers,” with Russel merely happening to be one man among them.

    All this paints a picture of a group effort, with many individuals pouring over Bible verses and coming to a collective consensus. This could not be farther from reality.

    Charles Taze Russell began the Watch Tower himself as a way to present his own writings, and was its sole editor, having complete control over its publication. In the December 1st 1916 Watchtower, Russell stated the following:

    He referred to himself as God’s Mouthpiece:

    • No, the truths I present, as God’s mouthpiece, were not revealed in visions or dreams, nor by God’s audible voice, nor all at once, but gradually, especially since 1870, and particularly since 1880. ” Watch Tower, July 15th1906, pg. 229

    He was known to his followers as Pastor Russell, and was the only Pastor among the bible students. Without question, Russell was the face and voice of his own movement. When The Photodrama of Creation was released, it was Russell’s own image on the poster.

    Followers were even referred to as Russellites in the press, though Watchtower maintains that the Bible Students rejected adopting the designation:

    • “What about the Bible Students? They were dubbed Russellites and Rutherfordites by the clergy. But adopting such a name would have fostered a sectarian spirit. It would have been inconsistent with the reproof given to early Christians by the apostle Paul, who wrote: “When one says: ‘I belong to Paul,’ but another says: ‘I to Apollos,’ are you not simply men [that is, fleshly in outlook instead of spiritual]?” —jv chap. 11 pp. 149-158

    After his death, the writers of the Watch Tower and other Bible Student/Witness publications maintained that Russell was the “faithful and wise servant” (now referred to as “faithful and discreet slave”) described in scripture. From the Watch Tower of May 1st, 1922:

    So why does the modern-day Watchtower downplay Russell’s role as the founder of Jehovah’s Witnesses?

    For one, the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses see themselves as the faithful and discreet slave described by Jesus (see: What is the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses?).

    For another, everything Russell taught to be “The Truth” is no longer taught to be “The Truth” by modern Jehovah’s Witnesses. Today Witnesses are told that the “last days” began in 1914, while Armageddon is set to begin very soon. Russell taught that the last days began in 1874, and that 1914 would be “the end of all things,” when Armageddon is completed, and the Bible Students would be called to heaven.

    Beyond this, though, Russell’s life was marked by controversy.

    Russell’s wife, Maria, left him in 1897, and they were separated until 1903 when she filed for divorce, citing among other things “improper intimacy” with his foster-daughter, Rose Ball. This is what Mrs. Russell stated in the trial:

    • A: [Rose] said one evening when she came with him, just as she got inside the hall, it was late in the evening, about eleven o’clock, he put his arms around her and kissed her. This was in the vestibule before they entered the hall, and he called her his little wife, but she said,”I am not your wife,” and he said, “I will call you daughter, and a daughter has nearly all the privileges of a wife.”
      Q.
       And what other terms were used?
      A. Then he said, “I am like a jelly-fish. I float around here and there. I touch this one and that one, and if she responds, I take her to me, and if not, I float on to others,” and she wrote that out so that I could remember it for sure when I would speak to him about it. And he confessed that he said those things.
      • The Washington Post May 4, 1906 pg 6, “The Rev. Jellyfish Russell”
      • Court Transcript: Prothonotary of Allegheny County

    It is not surprising that Watchtower wishes to scrub CT Russell from its history, but it is, at best, disingenuous.

  • Do Jehovah’s Witnesses Feel They Are the Only Ones Who Will Be Saved?

    Source: JW.ORG

    What JW.ORG says

    No. Many millions who lived in centuries past and who weren’t Jehovah’s Witnesses will have an opportunity for salvation. The Bible explains that in God’s promised new world, “there is going to be a resurrection of both the righteous and the unrighteous.” (Acts 24:15) Additionally, many now living may yet begin to serve God, and they too will gain salvation. In any case, it’s not our job to judge who will or won’t be saved. That assignment rests squarely in Jesus’ hands —John 5:22, 27.

    The Truth

    Saved from what? The FAQ does not specify, but it is reasonable to assume that Watchtower is talking about Armageddon, considering the supposed imminence of Armageddon is the core motivation behind Jehovah’s Witnesses’ beliefs and preaching work.

    Jehovah’s Witnesses do believe that they are the only ones who will be saved at Armageddon, and this is stated outright in their publications:

    • Only Jehovah’s Witnesses, those of the anointed remnant and the “great crowd,” as a united organization under the protection of the Supreme Organizer, have any Scriptural hope of surviving the impending end of this doomed system dominated by Satan the Devil.” Watchtower 1989 Sep 1 p.19

    • “During the final period of the ancient world that perished in the Flood, Noah was a faithful preacher of righteousness. (2 Peter 2:5) In these last days of the present system of things, Jehovah’s people are making known Gods righteous standards and are declaring good news about the possibility of surviving into the new world. (2 Peter 3:9-13) Just as Noah and his God-fearing family were preserved in the ark, survival of individuals today depends on their faith and their loyal association with the earthly part of Jehovah’s universal organization.” Watchtower 2006 May 15 p.22 “Are You Prepared for Survival?”

    • “Is it presumptuous of Jehovah’s Witnesses to point out that they alone have God’s backing? Actually, no more so than when the Israelites in Egypt claimed to have God’s backing in spite of the Egyptians’ belief, or when the first-century Christians claimed to have God’s backing to the exclusion of Jewish religionists.” Watchtower 2001 Jun 1 p.16
    • “Similarly, Jehovah is using only one organization today to accomplish his will. To receive everlasting life in the earthly Paradise we must identify that organization and serve God as part of it.” Watchtower 1983 Feb 15 p.12

    The wording of the JW.ORG FAQ is layered in its deceptiveness:

    • “Additionally, many now living may yet begin to serve God, and they too will gain salvation.”

    Since Watchtower proclaims that the only way to truly serve God is to be a part of their organization, the sentence is something of an oxymoron when reworded to properly reflect the reality of their teachings:

    • Do Jehovah’s Witnesses feel that they’re the only ones who will be saved? No, because many now living may yet convert to become one of Jehovah’s Witnesses.

    Watchtower also mentions that those who lived in “centuries past who were not Jehovah’s Witnesses” have the opportunity to be saved via resurrection after Armageddon, but their publications have a difficult time explaining how exactly this will work.

    • But what about those who may not seem to have been sufficiently exposed to the Kingdom message so as to have been able to make an intelligent choice for or against the truth before they died during these “last days”?​—2 Timothy 3:1.

      Many who die while the preaching work is in progress prior to the great tribulation will evidently receive a resurrection. This is indicated by what we read at Revelation 6:7, 8 concerning the ride of the symbolic horsemen. Many people have died as victims of wars, food shortages, and deadly plagues. Since it is “Hades” that claims these victims of “Death,” they will be resurrected during Christ’s Millennial Reign, when Hades gives up all the dead in it. (Revelation 20:13) A number of those raised to life may have had some contact with the Kingdom message before they died. w93 5/15 p. 31

    Confusingly, Watchtower preaches that those who die before “the great tribulation” have a shot at being resurrected to a paradise earth. However, should a non-Witness not die before the great tribulation, he will die in the war of Armageddon.

    •  Let us remember that once the great tribulation begins, it will be too late for people to turn to Jehovah. That is why our preaching work is so urgent!* w19 October pp. 8-13

    Even though Watchtower states that nobody will be able to turn to Jehovah once the great tribulation begins, Jehovah’s Witnesses are told in the same magazine that they are to begin preaching “a message of judgment” about the impending doom of Armageddon.

    • During the great tribulation, the message that we proclaim will likely change. Currently, we are preaching the good news of the Kingdom and we are endeavoring to make disciples. But at that time, we may well deliver a message as hard-hitting as hailstones. (Rev. 16:21) We may proclaim the impending doom of Satan’s world. In time, we will find out exactly what our message will be and how we will deliver it. Will we use the same methods we have used for over a hundred years to accomplish our ministry? Or will we use some other methods? We will have to wait and see. In any case, it seems that we will have the privilege of boldly proclaiming Jehovah’s judgment message!​Ezek. 2:3-5.

    Yes, according to Watchtower, when “the great tribulation” starts Jehovah’s Witnesses will have the “privilege” of proclaiming God’s judgment message, even though it will be “too late for people to turn to Jehovah.” They will be the only ones saved, and they will make sure people know it.